GA28 in Bakersfield California

[Dan Boccia]

Nice work getting through the BoatHowTo course! It's excellent information, covering much of what Nigel covers in his book. You're way ahead of the curve now!

[jov]

Thanks Dan. It really is a good course. It took me from being pretty nervous about the DC systems to feeling that I can probably handle the work. I still have a lot to learn and need to finish Nigel Calder's book, but the comfort level with the electrical systems before and after is night and day. I started it based on one of your posts and am really glad I did.

[jov]

I have been working on my circuit diagrams and my battery budget for the past week. The budget needs some work, and I still need to make some choices on what I want in the boat. I am also thinking a lot about how exactly I will use the boat to try to estimate power demands as best as possible. I have been watching Jeff Cote on YouTube. He mentioned winter and summer power demand will probably not be the same so I am working up different estimates for each plus one for multi-day trips.

Other than that I am working up some initial circuit diagrams. It has been really useful because I am seeing some areas of concern that I will need to consider. Mainly my anchor winch. I would like a lithium house bank but the winch could be a problem with the BMS. Looking around the forum I first considered Kilvault and Firefly AGM but it appears they are both out of business. So I am in the process of finding another lithium battery that can handle the anchor winch. Other options may be going with an AGM house bank or have 3 banks (AGM Starter, Lithium house, AGM Winch). Don't really like the extra weight of the second option. I will keep researching and try to figure it out.

[json]

I recently went on an overnight trip out at San Clemente island and got much deeper into my house bank than I thought I would (I had used about half of my 400 amp hours by the time I returned the next day). It was surprising how quickly things added up, not that it was at all worrisome, but I just wasn't expecting to have used that much. In retrospect I did spend the vast majority of the time on anchor so there wasn't much charging happening. Another thing that can help with the winch and bms issue is more batteries in parallel, which will reduce the demand on each one, so instead of potentially getting larger batteries to make your bank get more smaller ones (provided the bms is comparable in both). I have had no problem running my winch on 2 kilovault hlx+ batteries but as you said, they have beefy bms's and are now out of business, so... \_(ツ)_/

[Dan Boccia]

There are two good solutions to selecting a battery for the anchor winch:

1. Use a lithium battery with a robust BMS. Most anchor winches for boats our size have around 100A continuous motors. In use I rarely see above 40-50A continuous, but the inrush current when you first start the winch is what challenges the BMS. This can be up around 300A or so. If you have a house battery system of 300-400A, you can find 150-200 AH lithium batteries that have 150A continuous rating which should work fine (2 batteries in parallel). Epoch, Lion, and others have them (they're more expensive than the budget lithium batteries)

2. My favorite way is to install an Odyssey Extreme AGM start battery and also run the winch from it. This is a TPPL AGM battery that is capable of very high current loads. This is what is specified by many bow thruster installers. The duration of the winch pull is relatively short so in terms of amp-hours, it will only discharge the battery minimally. I've built a couple of boats out this way and the owners report trouble-free use so far.

I would strongly encourage avoiding a 3rd battery bank - this will just lead to inefficiencies in your charging system and unnecessary complexity, extra equipment, and weight.

[jov]

json,
That makes sense. I am not sure if need a house bank as big as yours, but I will look into going that way. I have mainly done estimations for day trips. I should probably put some together for overnights or multi day trips.

Dan,
I will look into the lithiums you mentioned with the more robust BMS. I had considered using the start battery but was concerned about discharging it too much while running the winch. If it works for the other boats you built, it should probably work for me. I will reconsider.

Thanks guys. That helps a lot.

[jov]

I managed to get back in my shop a little bit this week. Starting to cool down a little bit. I don't really have any interesting pictures to share this week. Mainly just fairing and cleaning stuff up. I finished up the cuddy sole, cuddy sole support, aft anchor deck bulkhead, and forward cuddy bulkhead. They should be ready to install now. I still need to add the doubler to anchor well deck and work under the shelves a little before installing the anchor deck. Weather permitting I am going to try to start installing the cuddy sole next week.

I also finished up my battery budget estimations. I put together several hypothetical trips and thought about what was necessary from an electronics standpoint for each. Trolling vs drifting. Long run vs short run to the spot. Good sunlight vs weak sunlight for the solar. I also did 1,2, and 3 day trips. It was really helpful to understand my potential energy expenditures. Since I am not going to have a fridge or other energy heavy devices, it looks like I can get away with a 100 ah house bank but will probably go to 200 ah to be safe.

[Dan Boccia]

I have a high quality 85 AH Fullriver AGM battery for my house going on 6 years now, and I take trips up to 5 days long and sit on the hook with only short runs to check shrimp pots a couple times per day. That said, it's usually summer in AK with lots of sunlight for the solar. This battery runs my 100A anchor winch and 60A pot puller (with engine running and 30A battery to battery charger supplementing power), plus small fridge, full electronics setup, etc. So your 100AH house battery with no fridge or AC system may be just fine as long as it's an AGM from a quality vendor and you won't have an AC system.

You will need a battery to battery charger for proper charging....do NOT use an ACR or otherwise charge an AGM (or lithium) house battery directly from the engine's charging system. Your start battery can be a cheap flooded lead acid unit that can handle the higher voltages outboards put out sometimes.

The list of quality AGM deep cycle batteries in the US is short: Fullriver, Lifeline, Victron, Northstar, Rolls (made by Full River)) and that's it. Seriously.
Otherwise, go lithium, and be sure to get one with bluetooth so you can tell what's going on inside. For 100AH, after several lithium installations, I'm starting to think lithium isn't worth it unless your bank is larger than 100AH or you are particularly tech savvy and ok with the additional attention needed.

[Dan Boccia]

Also: Buy a Victron Blue Smart IP65 battery charger, 15 amp version, download the Victron Connect app, and do a custom AGM program:
14.6V bulk
13.6 float
13.6 storage

Use this charger to maintain your AGM battery when you're not using it for more than a week or two and any longer layups. With proper care a good AGM battery should last at least 10 years. I've had one AGM battery last 16 years of hard service because I take care of them.

There is literally zero competition for these chargers in the market. All other chargers available either do not put out the voltages they advertise, or don't tell you what voltages they put out at all (and upon testing have horrible charge profiles). This includes Noco Genius, Battery Tenders, etc....all junk! Pretty much all the marine electricians I know have gone to all Victron charging devices for this reason. For solar, use Victron MPPT charge controllers, use their Orion XS battery to battery charger, and the above-mentioned portable charger. All programmable from the same bluetooth app which is super stable and well supported. Wish another vendor would step up to the plate on this front!

[jov]

Thank you so much for all the information Dan. It is so helpful to have someone so knowledgeable providing advice.

[jov]

This week I got my doubler install on my anchor deck. I am hoping get it in the boat next week. I also managed to install the cuddy cabin sole support. I am going to put a coat of Bilge Kote or something similar in the cuddy under sole area. It might slow me down a little, but I figure either next week or the week after I should have the cuddy sole installed.

[Brian.Dixon]

Are you going to put a little bilge pump under the cuddy sole?  Boats tend to trim bow-down when you have a couple of people up front sleeping overnight ... otherwise, just plug all water routes forward before you hit the rack.

[jov]

My plan was to have a small bilge pump just behind the rear cuddy bulkhead. I could plug the under cuddy undersole area from the front through collision chamber and the from the back from compartment (with bilge pump) between the rear cuddy bulkhead and the fuel tank compartment.

[jov]

I got anchor well deck installed last week. I used the method Lindy did. The anchor deck is tilted to follow the shear. Figured it would have to help drainage. It should be roughly 7 inches from the deck to the shear throughout. I ran my level on it and it was about 8 degrees of tilt. I still need to fillet and tape the seams but overall I am pretty happy with it.

I also finished up the area under the cuddy floor. I checked and water drains pretty well out of it. I took a little extra time on it becasue I wanted to be sure there were no pockets where water could get trapped. Hopefully, there is never water in there but just in case. I should be able to get the cuddy floor installed pretty soon.

[jov]

I got the aft anchor well bulkhead installed and filled any gaps left between the hull and the deck (support block locations). Everything feels really solid. The tilted anchor well deck looks really nice. I still need to fillet and glass all the joints. The forward cuddy bulkhead is also ready to be installed, but I wanted to make sure my aft anchor well bulkhead was solid before installing the forward cuddy bulkhead. I received the bilge paint for the under cuddy sole area. Should be able to start on that painting next week.

I haven't gotten a ton done on the boat over the last week because I went to Florida to visit family. I did mange to get a couple days in fishing. My dad and I did a day inshore saltwater fishing and caught tarpon, red fish, and speckled trout. I also got a day bass fishing and got some small mouth. It has really got me motivated to work on the boat and get it out fishing.